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I found in Open Archives Hendrina Wenting baptized November 10, 1781. Then I found Anna Wenting and Hendrina Wenting Baptized as listed together for Oct. 30, 1783. Anna in Church records with witnesses and right side with what a appears to be a letter "P" and then Hendrina Wenting mentioned below witnesses but not as a witness. Then Anna Baptized October 30, 1784. There is no mention of twins or deaths shortly after baptisms. Parents in all instances are listed as Joannes Wenting and Joanna Westhoff. I have been searching for 4 years for my 4 x great grandmother Hendrina. I heard stories (rumors) in the family that she was raised by her aunt and uncle after the tragic death of her parents shortly after her birth. She had an illegitimate son my 3x great grandfather Joannes Wenting born April 29, 1811. He was married twice, first wife Maretje Hop and then Hendrica Dekker. I was wondering if there is any other record to be found on any of the events described above that could lead me to solve this mystery. She seems to have been in Old Zevenaar, Duiven or Arnhem area and I do not know who her parents were or where she was born.She seems to not exist anywhere and  I have looked extensively. I am thinking it may be possible to have something to do with the baptisms. I believe she went by the name Hendrina and not Anna but can not find any existence for her or her family only baptism of her son. She is also mentioned in a court submission on Joannes in his request to marry Maretje and his mother was declared as deceased sometime around 1828 which I believe to be false and a Hanna Wenting is reputed to be her sister as a witness. This same witness was married to another mentioned, Manus Van Doornik whom I found a Anna Wenting married to Hermanus van Doornik both were coach men and other documents showing her name as Johanna Wenting. Anybody that can shed some light on this would be awesome. Thanks

Shirley Hohm

Joannes Wenting en Joanna Westhoff huwden op 28.8.1777 (RK) in Oud-Zevenaar.

G. Karssenberg

A daughter of J. Wenting, aged 10 days, was buried in RC Oud Zevenaar on 19.10.1783 (link). The index may be useful here.

Peter S

The registration of the baptism on 9.10.1783 is here - I only see an Anna, no Hendrina, so no twins. A mistake in the index? Edit: A Hendrina Wenting is mentioned but as a witness - possibly a witness replacing or being replaced by another, I forget. Do note the 3-column format used on each page: child, parents, witnesses.

Peter S

Zie de huwelijkse bijlagen bij het huwelijk van Joannes Wenting met Maretje Hop in Utrecht op 10.7.1839 - vooral de images 987 en 988.

G. Karssenberg

@G.Karssenberg recommends checking out this page and the next: link. Do you need a translation?

Peter S

Thank you very much, yes please a translation would be greatly appreciated.

Shirley Hohm

[The following is a formal statement that was found between the "huwelijkse bijlagen" of Wenting and Hop; there are further documents on this couple after these 2 scans, including a statement on the military service by Johannes on scan 996 which gives a description of his physical appearance.] I noticed this document is also referred to in the question, but sort of dismissed, even though it is a legal submission from 4 witnesses. I see no reason to dismiss this myself.

Today the 2nd July 1839 appeared for me, Mr Louis Henri Rambormet, judge in the first canton of the first arrondissement of the Gelderland province, principal town Arnhem, assisted by our registrar Wouter Appel, at our common places in the building of the provincial government at Arnhem.
1. Hanna Wenting aged 47 yrs, without profession, housewife of Hermanus van Doornik, a carter.
2. Frans Göris master smith, aged 41yrs.
3. Everardus Mattijssen aged 60yrs, guardian
4. Gerardus Everardus Mattijssen aged 29yrs
All living at Arnhem.
These comparants/witnesses appeared, truthfully, and to the benefit of Johannes Wenting, shoemaker, until recently living at Arnhem but now moving to Utrecht and intending to marry, and requiring for his marriage a proof of the death of his mother whereas such a proof could not be found in the register of Amsterdam, each of the comparants affirms separately that they are certain to know that Johannes Wenting a son is of Hendrina Wenting, and that she the mother has died in about 1828 at Amsterdam in one of the hospitals.
As basis of this knowledge the witnesses declare: the first witness, that she became certain of this as the sister of the mother, the second named witness had known and had had dealings with the woman for a long time and that at the time of the death the sister of his wife guardian was at the hospital and immediately upon the death had written a letter to this witness, and finally that the witness declared to have had dealings with the son from his early youth. The third witness states that the named Johannes Wenting in his earliest youth has been a lodger with him and his wife, because the mother was a servant and as such unable to raise him and that he had stayed with this witness at home up to the start of his military service - that the witness upon the death of the mother had received a message from Amsterdam and from the first witness - the fourth witness states that as the son of the third witness he is certain of the course of events described by his father.
Finally, all witnesses declare that the family name of the witness and the son has often been stated incorrectly as Wentink and that the first name of the mother was Hendrina as in the above not Hendrika.
Having seen the declaration of being unable to pay for marriage from Mr Visscher Bouricus acting mayor of Arnhem dated the 20th this month [see scan 989], this deed of acquaintance with a death has been drawn up free of charge, and duly signed, etc.

Peter S

Shirley, welcome to this forum

The Roman Catholique baptism books use sometimes the following abbreviations testus for witness, p can be father or patrinus. m can be mater [mother] or matrines. Get for getuige or witness

You could also find v  m  k  p For vader [father] mother, kind [child] peten

A patrines [peter or peetoom in dutch]  was not only a witness but also the man that would raise the child if it became an orphanThe same is for the matrines [meter or meettante in dutch] Or both mentioned as "peten"

Anna and Antje is the common, daily used form of Johanna/Joanna

Jan Achterberg

Regarding the sister of Hendrina, Anna Wenting who married van Doornik, just for completeness: her marriage is here on image 24. The accompanying documents (which start here) confirm that this is the Anna that was baptised on 30.10.1784, from Wenting and Westhof. So the age given in her statement in 1839 is not accurate, but this is common in the 19th century.

Peter S

And to note that Hendrina's parents, Johannes Wenting and Johanna Westhof were still alive at the time of the marriage of their daughter Anna in 1819, see the link in my previous message. Edit: they died at Groessen (shiould be municipality of Duiven) 1825/1826, see here.

Peter S

The death certificate of Johannes Wenting is here, at Groessen (Duiven) he died on 22.11.1826. The names of his parents were not known. Johanna Westhof's death record is here.

Peter S

Thank you very much for all your help it has been greatly appreciated. 

Can you direct me to where I might check the hospital records if Ansterdam. I have checked for Hendrina in the Stadsarchive in Amsterdam patient records and their is no record of her death there. Is there a possible other location I could check? 

Thakjs again for translating as well huge help. 

Sincerely

shirley

Shirley Hohm

Thank you for your help, very much appreciated the info was great.

Shirley Hohm


Can you direct me to where I might check the hospital records if Ansterdam. I have checked for Hendrina in the Stadsarchive in Amsterdam patient records and their is no record of her death there. Is there a possible other location I could check? 

You probably have seen all there is already, which to my knowledge is here. In particular, sections 1.2.5.1, 2.2.5.2. Presumably a problem may be that 1828 is very early for patient records in what we now would call hospitals. I'm not sure she will have been in the Binnengasthuis or the Buitengasthuis, there may have been others.

Peter S







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